From - Fri May 15 16:08:25 1998 From: "Jean-Yves Avenard" Hello all. Vijay Narayan Ramasubramanian wrote in message <6jgi33$9ti@hermes.acs.unt.edu>... >Peter Karp wrote: >> Hi Vijay, >> just my personal opinion to your post: >> purpose tool and a programming environment, so I would have left some >> memory on the RAM-card in Slot 1 to put some libs there. > > >This is not possible unless you have the source code or Jean-Yves decides >to be generous in describing his trick. While it's illegal to modify the >MK even for personal use, I would have bought the RAM version and done >it/found some one to help break it down, but I think it's a very hard task >to do. > Even with the source code, it will be very difficult to split the MK into several parts. In order to describe a little the part of each components of the MK, here they are: -Equation Writer: 19kb -MASD: 14kb -EDG (Graphic Editor): 9kb -Matrix Writer: 5.5kb -Filer: 13kb - ->STR : 17kb -- total: 77.5kb Kernel (command line, stack, GUI, tools (A-> , SREPL etc...), fonts, user rpl debugger) 50.5kb As you can see, to split up the MK between a user version, and a programming version. What do you need when you are a programmer: -EDG -MASD -FILER - ->STR The ->STR and MASD are very, very linked. the ->STR command use MASD in order to search in the table It means you will save 24kb, where you can put a SysRplDebugger and a ML Debugger. For a user version, we wil remove the MASD. 14kb saved. the MK was designed to be a ROM card since the beginning, it use absolute addresses, and that's why it is so small. Yes, so small, even if it's 128kb, nearly half of the ROM has been rewritten, plus much more features (asm, graphic editor, symbolic matrix writer). Just have a look to the matrix writer, only 5.5kb: that's nothing, just because it shares all the display program, the GUI, the key handler from the kernel. the built-in matrix writer of the ROM, which handle far less objects than the MK's one is 29kb !! What about the Equation writer, there is a reason if that there's no real alternative to the built-in equation writer (except RainEQ but it's not finished yet) > >> Your wish list is sure everything but a Mini-Challange! So I dont >> think you will find someone programming a new *MetaKernel* (especially >> for free!) I am very glad that there are so many freeware programms > >I wouldn't mind paying for it. Even a simliar amount to MK? (Maybe MK Team >will release MK Lite or a "modulerized version" of MK? With loadable >programs from the MK so one could get a really customized version? I asked >Jean-Yves about this, but I don't think it'll happen...). > What you asked is actually, simply impossible, I'm not a student anymore, and the time I can spend on the MK now is closed to zero. Of course I will prefer to continue to work on it, and just to publish it as a freeware. Many people think that we did the MK for money, while the MK was a shareware, even if we sold nearly 400 copies, we earnt each of us: 4200FF, for a 5 years job ! Just because it was so expensive to print the manual and to reply to all the letters As an example, StringWriter, were nobody had to register, (more than 950 registrations) * 50FF, and nothing in return, the cost was nearly 0 for me ! I don't think that anybody will have time to spend nearly, let say 3 years for a program now. > >> that help bypass some weaks of the HP and add so much of funcionality. >> I have installed UFL, EQStk, TED, FPX and some math libs and tools. >> With them the calc is very usable and I do have to use the slow INPUT >> forms very seldom. >> I will use Java when a new version which fixes some minor bugs will be >> released. I hope Andre, Will and Richard will find the time doing >> this. > >Java and the other utils you mentioned are very useful, I'll try FPX. $5 >is an okay charge. > > >> Maybe the MK will be released as a RAM-version again and could be >> split up. That would be great also... > the problem is that we have a contract a Da Vinci, that says : da vinci is the only distributor for the MK > >Or maybe they'd allow you to buy the "parts" you needed as packs (like >Utils Pack (filer, char browser), Math Pack (EQ, new plotter,), Stackpack >(Stack replacemnt), Graphic Replacement (Grob editor, viewer), GUI >Pack (Choose2, input2, etc) Program Pack (string reversal, etc). I would >really really really go for this. I'd however doubt this'll happen as I'm >sure to save space a *lot* of MK code is reused. > the problem is that many people wants the MK without the MK, you have to choose. And as you said, by splitting the MK you won't save a lot of space, simply because nearly all of you have a different meaning about what is the best compilation of programs. As I said, the MK was designed for a ROM card. To split it, will increase the size A LOT, and will slow down everything >> the HP48 Archive. >> Last but not least THANX to all programmers, who share their time and >> talent building those wonderfull libs, the whole HP48 community >> benefits! > Yes, many thanks to everybody on comp.sys.hp48 One day, the MK will be free, but the Da vinci contract will end only in two years... means you have to wait... Jean-Yves